I had the same vibe and I still have it regarding Nuxt 3.
Had it with React when it moved to functional components from class components.
But I convinced myself I have to dive deep enough to understand it since a lot of people seem to like it. And now I like the Composition API more in general.
Apart from one tidbit: I constantly forget where I need to put `.value` after a variable name to extract its... value.
Being conscious of variable types and function signatures helps you avoid trivial errors and become a more efficient developer. That's just a fact.
You can argue with it or ignore it however you want, but that's simply true.
I also know as a matter of fact that I am more productive than many of my colleagues when working with non statically compiled languages, and that my code is more robust, partly due to the typing I use everywhere. I have colleagues that write JavaScript functions that takes a parameter that could be 4 different types of objects, completely undocumented, and they don't know what's happening one week after shipping the code. I can't stop them doing stupid things like that. They like wasting their life debugging things and refreshing the browser, what can I do.
I raised the same concerns multiple times (there was a whole drama thread on GitHub issues at the time) about all of this and it’s clear that the Vue team don’t really care about developer experience or keeping consistent APIs.
If they were going to poorly clone react hooks api then I decided it wasn’t worth my time sticking to the niche framework and went back to react which I now really enjoy.
That and the bad TS support and broken dev tooling for years and the endless deprecated and abandoned tools like Vue CLI replaced by Vite and Vuex replaced by Pinia just highlighted the absurdity of trying to continue using Vue.
Also, JSX/TSX is clearly a superior approach with its vast ecosystem of support. Vue can use TSX but good luck with its single docs page and GitHub issues about it open since 2021.
> the Vue team don’t really care about developer experience
This is how you stir up drama instead of constructive discussions. Clearly the team do care quite a lot about developer experience, but they might have different ideals and goals than you do. So lets discuss those differences as adults.
Vue is all about developer experience. It is a framework! But you can’t make everyone happy which is why there are multiple frameworks. If React makes you happy, good for you. Vue made different trade-offs in order to achieve a different DX.
Looking into the different trade-offs is interesting.
I don't like where Vue is headed and I really dislike some of their newer design decisions but as some other commenter in this thread also stated, them having different opinions does not mean that they think the subject at hand is lower priority.
But also it needs to be said that improving DX (or UX, when we are at that) is not about pleasing the majority. It's about the experience for our target audience, which doesn't have to be the majority.
I can also care about design, while my choices look ugly for most people.
This is what I was getting at. The 2 to 3 migration and steam rolling over any raised concerns on GitHub while concurrently abandoning Vuex and Vue CLI for alternatives definitely does not even begin to meet minimal DX commitments.
Pinia have a far better DX than Vuex though. Vuex had a lot of boilerplate and “stringly-typed” actions. Of course the migration in itself have a cost.
Vite is so great it is getting adopted by other frameworks. (It is not tightly coupled to Vue)
There was absolutely no reason Pinia couldn’t have been Vuex 5.
I raised that point more than once and was always given the lamest reason for it.
They believed people would be “too confused” with the breaking changes in the new API.
This was always a dumb explanation. That’s what major versions are for - breaking changes. Of course upgrading from Vuex 4 to 5 would involve refactoring code.
Pinia is of course mush better and has real types. But they did themselves a huge disservice by not making that Vuex 5. That lack of focus on cohesive framework options and senseless deprecation of already established libraries is the major problem.
Sorry for being reductionist. I will try to do better. But you literaly say you are happy with the API changes from Vuex to Pinia, so it is unclear to me what you dislike apart from the name change?
I don’t work on Vue itself and cant speak for that team. I’m a developer who use both Vue and React daily and seem to be an exception in that I rather like both, while recognizing both have different strengths and weaknesses (I have also tried other frameworks like Angular which i didn’t like).
I mean, where are you getting "the majority" from? At least for myself and my company, we're heavily invested in Vue and we love CompAPI. Most people I interact with in the Vue 3 community also seem to like it with some niggles here and there (like the oft-misunderstood `.value`).
During the transition from 2 -> 3 it was a bit messy and I was even against the CompAPI originally, but after having actually used it in our app, it's miles better IMO. I understand all the pro-Options arguments and don't necessarily disagree with a lot of the criticisms about CompAPI, either.
OptionsAPI still exists, and probably always will, since it's already and always was an extra layer built on top of the underlying CompAPI, which itself was exposed publicly in Vue 3.
"Our highly educated and well ret... regarded colleges from a different department have different priorities that do not seem to contribute to our shared goal as defined by the Policy which our dear leadership bless us with" (finishes writing and takes 1h lunch break)
Me too. The options api enforced grouping and you could lint the ordering of the lifecycle methods, methods, computed, data etc. Thjs made it very easy to know where to find something inside a component
Grouping is good until you have a UI component that needs to do 3 different things. It will be a mess because everything is mixed together. See official example: https://vuejs.org/guide/extras/composition-api-faq.html . This has been tremendously useful for developing large components.
If you haven't found a need for this, great for you. Options APIs will also continue to be available for the foreseeable future. But that doesn't mean it is better in any way.
I like the options api but what I like about the setup api is that you don’t have to import components then specify them in components property. Makes it a lot easier when doing go to source, and you can just import them automaticallly with dev tools.
i find it so much harder to grok the structure of Vue 3.x code. A data variable or prop can be defined literally anywhere. And it could be directly reactive or a ref. It's all cognitive load I didn't need before. Vue was always "worse" than react in both mind share and flexibility / purity and power. But it made up for all of it with the beautiful intuitive simplicity. So much of that is lost but I find it hard to argue any of the other aspects are better than React now. So Vue just feels overall a bit mediocre now.
I will say, with 2.x about 50% of bugs where not using Vue.set(...) in some obscure place or way, and those have all gone away, which I love.
We're currently going through a migration of writing new components in composition style, but obviously have a lot of experience with the options API and a lot of existing code using it.
It's taken the team some time to get used to how to do things in the new way, but on balance, we do like it.
It feels like there have been some odd caveats, like the new reactivity system approach not working exactly like we'd expect. But caveats exist in the options API too.
Yeah, I don't get it. I used Vue because it was straightforward. The options interface was Vue. Now, if it keeps getting more complicated and also has two ways to go about things, and the docs are split into two as well... Why not just go for React that's complicated and more popular?
I thought the composition API was clunky at first and resisted migrating for a few minor versions, but it's matured nicely. I find it much simpler than the options API, and migration was much easier than I expected.
I don't see it as two ways in practice, just the legacy way for old projects (which still has good support), and the newer/better way.
Asking because my experience is that as soon as you have a large and complex component that needs to have multiple, mostly independent functionalities, you'll find the composition APIs to be a godsend. Not to mention all the IDE support. You won't see that until you have first have experience with it.
